overated (overhyped) BtVS episode


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taraswizard	overated (overhyped) BtVS episode	Lead	[-]
Posts: 734 (12/04/03 04:42:04) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Tags : None OK, plan Cers, got this idea from Hellmouth Central. But kinda basically looking at an overhyped episode of BtVS. And as a suggestion (suggestion only), limit our initial discussion to three episodes Hush, Restless, Once more with Feeling. OK, everyone post, and I promise to play nice about this topic. I have my own ideas, but will save them for later. Allan Rosewarne Chicago area, IL W/T Forever Always W:...I think about what you grew up with and then I look at what you are, and it makes me proud. It makes me love you more T: Every time I--even when I am at my worst, you always make me feel special. --- How do you do that? W: Magic
Bones98	Re: overated (overhyped) BtVS episode	#1	[-]
Posts: 13 (12/04/03 06:10:02) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Bless you for having the nerve to start a thread like this... RESTLESS .....Joss attempts a David Lynch and mis-fires ....Personally I thought Riley had the best lines, which is a scarey thought in itself ..... A lot of interesting ideas but I just couldn't get interested.... and they baulked on showing Tara/Willow lip-pressing, which didn't help my interest level.... sigh .... I know I haven't stated specifically why but Restless is over-rated and just average as an episode.... I actually like Hush and OMWF.... OK....Next poster!! ( Save me from being incoherent!! ...) ---
snakesssz	Re: overated (overhyped) BtVS episode	#2	[-]
Posts: 79 (12/04/03 23:53:46) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	I don't think Hush or OMWF were overrated. Especially not OMWF. I haven't tired of that episode yet. Restless on the otherhand... while somewhat interesting for it's oddness, yeah, I think that one is a bit overrated. Doing something new and different can be a really good thing, but doing something JUST to be different can backfire and turn out just to be kind of lame. And while Restless did have it's moments - I did enjoy Xander keeping ending up back in the basement no matter what else he did in his dream, and I think the off-screen Willow/Tara kissage was a network censor deal, not the choice of anyone actually involved with the show (censors, boo, hiss) - overall, choosing to end the season with an anticlimactic and confusing episode, in my opinion, didn't really work and did in fact seem to be just kind of lame. On the other other hand... who didn't love the cheese guy?! Rosey P.S. Though this goes off of your suggested episodes for discussion, I think the truly most overrated episode ever of BtVS, was The Body. This is a fantasy show. I don't watch it for "deeply moving, realistic dealing with death and grief, blah, blah, blah...". This "very special episode" had "Please give me an Emmy" written all over it.
EvilsGood	Re: overated (overhyped) BtVS episode	#3	[-]
Posts: 3189 (12/05/03 00:21:56) Moderator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	See, I'd argue that The Body was a prime example of how to do that kind of story right. It showed the characters in an unflattering, totally realistic light. It was jarring. It made me feel. For overhyped, can I say (as a theme, not just a particular ep), Spike getting his frikkin' soul? I mean, feh. Hard to play yes, and James did well. But it wasn't original, now was it? _______________________________________________ "Fuck me. It's a baby grand piano!" -- Anthony Stewart Head, Moonlight Rising 2003 Plan C \| Blood of the Banned \| Willow-Kennedy Yahoo Group \| Essence of Amber \| Moonlight Rising
taraswizard	Re: overated (overhyped) BtVS episode	#4	[-]
Posts: 734 (12/05/03 04:21:41) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	I am glad who commented who did . Interesting comments and very good discussion. My own opinions..... Over on another thread I, I said IMO Hush was the best episode of BtVS ever. So it would be hard for me to say it's been overhyped. OMWF I like lots. OTOH, Restless is a whole different kettle of fish. Specifics to follow. Rosie, and everyone else, the three episodes I brought up in my first post were just suggestions. If anyone else has another episode they believe is overated, let's put it out on the table. Keep the discussion going!! Allan Rosewarne Chicago area, IL W/T Forever Always W:...I think about what you grew up with and then I look at what you are, and it makes me proud. It makes me love you more T: Every time I--even when I am at my worst, you always make me feel special. --- How do you do that? W: Magic
superZONic	Restless	#5	[-]
Posts: 1811 (12/06/03 22:39:56) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	I have to completely disagree with folks here who are dissing one of my favorite episodes, Restless. I love that the season ended on such a kooky and kinda ominous note. I had little idea of some of the plot developments that were forshadowed but the ambiguity had me salivating all summer for the new season to start. The references to past episodes and character development were as usual, arcane and a delight. Mainly tho it was an episode that made me laugh out loud several times...SO much to love. The entire play was just classic....Harmony, Giles, & Riley crack my shit up EVERY TIME i rewatch. The bizarre dialog and ridiculous delivery were sheer genius. Xanders freaky deaky encounter with Joyce and comfortador sex. Xander in the truck with WIllow and Tara dolled up like french whores. Anya driving with hand gestures. Gile's entire segment from Spike's photoshoot to Willow waving a lighter while Giles implores Xander not to bleed on his couch. Brilliant! The sets and direction were wicked cool. The vaginal curtains [not sure Lynch was commenting on vaginas when he used crimson...shrug maybe he was] and Tara's sapphic back-writings were somewhat sophisticated and not your every day GoG references. Xander's Being Jon Malkovich-esque trapse thru door after door was a respectably wacky homage to an homage. As far as auteurs who's creations shine bright as a thousand suns and then spurt and fizzle before they finally die, i'll take Joss any day over Lynch. The entertainment levels and intelligence were sustained for far longer than Twin Peaks (and i'm a fan of both). Nope. Underated in my book. It stands the test of time along with Hush, The Body, and OMWF. How he doesn't have an Emmy for each of these episodes will forever baffle me. Anything with Angel and Buffy is over-hyped in my opinion. I think i actually giggled when she sent him to hell with the sword under the armpit maneuver and that episode is constantly listed as a fan favorite.
EvilsGood	Re: Restless	#6	[-]
Posts: 3189 (12/06/03 23:08:02) Moderator Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	*Quote:* Anything with Angel and Buffy is over-hyped in my opinion. Cookie dough?! _______________________________________________ "Fuck me. It's a baby grand piano!" -- Anthony Stewart Head, Moonlight Rising 2003 Plan C \| Blood of the Banned \| Willow-Kennedy Yahoo Group \| Essence of Amber \| Moonlight Rising
Shaniezak	Re: overated (overhyped) BtVS episode	#7	[-]
Posts: 249 (12/07/03 01:18:23) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	cough I think New Moon Rising is overrated . . . Rhiannon "Shaniezak" Silverflame ---------------------------- "In fact, this may have escaped your keen notice, but . . . I'm kind of a brat. I've sort of always gotten my way. So you're gonna make it through this no matter how dark it gets, because now? You're my way." -- Kennedy, "Chosen"
taraswizard	Re: overated (overhyped) BtVS episode	#8	[-]
Posts: 734 (12/07/03 22:37:39) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	taraswizard wrote this meaningless junk a day or so ago *Quote:* OTOH, Restless is a whole different kettle of fish. Specifics to follow. Gonna agree with BPE, Rosie, and Bones98. Restless IMO is one thing that just completely misfires and really misses any marks at all. And before whole lots of people tell me it's all about the characters, I offer that three other episodes Nightmares, Halloween and Fear Itself give full and complete a full character expositions without resorting to obscure, IMO, symbolism and silly scenes like Spike in a swing. Furthermore, I am not at all fond of the Xander part that's allegedly based on Apocalypse Now, a movie I do not especially like either. Lastly, JW has admitted to writing the espisode while he was sick with the flu, well like I can tell. Well, I could be all full of it here, YMMV. FWIW, I have never been able to watch this episode completely through, for lots of reasons. Becoming part II is an episode I like, and it hits all the right marks (action, drama, peril and all the stuff B usually delivers), but to me it is just your average good BtVS episode not the great masterpiece of season enders. I think The Gift and Graduation Day are far better season ending episodes. Gonnna agree with Zon and BPE about The Body. What an episode, touching on so many things BtVS is about; for example, B can not save everyone, and even when great apocalyptic peril faces us all you can still die of an infection or an anuerysm. And everyone knows it is the only episode without music. Just to clear up my general ideas and attitudes. FWIW, I do not think in seven seasons and 144 episodes there were any episodes that would be called bad, some better than others, some I like more. BUT none bad. They can all get a TX Tacky, if I was giving them out. Let the discussion, continue. And maybe some would like to elaborate on their previous statements. And if any new episodes get mentioned, please fell free to do so. Allan Rosewarne Chicago area, IL W/T Forever Always W:...I think about what you grew up with and then I look at what you are, and it makes me proud. It makes me love you more T: Every time I--even when I am at my worst, you always make me feel special. --- How do you do that? W: Magic
FuzzyFlyingBunny	Re: overated (overhyped) BtVS episode	#9	[-]
Posts: 530 (12/08/03 05:17:55) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Regarding the episode Restless, I have a love hate relationship with it. I personally love it because of the obscure symbols and imagery and the almost Lynchian feel. I love the way it was shot and appreciate it more as a aesthetic piece then a episode in an series arc. I hate the episode because every episode after it was analyzed up the wazoo with this as the foreshadowing template which in turn IMO made this episode over-hyped. I don't know if I consider The Body over-hyped. I like the episode myself. We all know that BtVS is a supernatural metaphor for growing up as a teen and this episode sorta pulled us back into reality. It took away the fantastical elements and made their reactions real because in the real world we normal folk don't have the superpowers to beat up our demons so it brought them to our level. Some people don't like it because of the "if I wanted real I'll watch the news" which I understand but me, I thought it was great to touch base with reality for a bit. It sorta made the characters and the show grow up too. I also am glad they didn't put music to the episode because this way it was felt more harsh while with music it might have felt (at least to me) mushy and over dramtic. I agree with you Allen on the Becoming episodes. I personally think the Becoming two parter is the prime example of the best of Buffy. All the action, angst, humour, mythology, romance, and what not in 90 mins. Every character gets their moment to shine. ---------------- Got to sing. Got to dance. Got to suck face with Alyson Hannigan. - Amber at Toronto Trek Break me off a switch, son. There's about to be a whuppin'. - Faith in Orpheus Repent for the End is extremely fucking nigh. - 28 Days Later That was nifty. - Willow in Chosen
whitenight922	Re: overated (overhyped) BtVS episode	#10	[-]
Posts: 390 (12/08/03 11:15:03) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	I don't know much about hype. I just know what I like. I think the biggest award should probably go to Tabula Rasa. It wasn't easy to follow an episode that was so heavily advertised (okay, I do know a little about hype,) and not feel disappointed. I don't remember feeling that way with Buffy episodes, though. Anyway, I like almost everything about every episode, and don't like a few things in most of the episodes. I still say, this was the best series ever made. There is one episode that had more bad than good in my opinion. That was, I have to say again, the one right after Tabula Rasa. I can't even remember the name of it. Sorry, I've said this before, but that episode simply ruined the rest of the season for me the first couple of times. Now I let myself get past that, and see the rest of the season was more good than bad. (I still say graphic Spike and Buffy was horrifying.) So since I love the show so much, I don't think they could overhype or overrate. As for Restless, my favorite Riley line has to be "We have lots of work to do. Filing and giving things names." That totally sums up government work. Maybe a little photocopying thrown in for good measure. There was so much funny stuff in that episode! As far as subtle clues to the future (which this ep was not so subtle,) I still don't see that much. I love how when I watch again, I can see more subtle hints. In season 1 ep 3 (I'm getting old. I can't remember names. Was it simply The Witch?) Xander tells Willow not to "Drive it through my head like a railroad spike," which could be referring to season 2's bad guy! I don't remember if there were any more, I'll have to watch again. I do remember a comment about glory in season 4. I also like the movie references, which I at least noticed in the beginning. Oz talking about an evil mastermind, (Austin Powers) and Willow telling Xander not to catch her hair on fire. (Dead Man On Campus.) Those are my favorites, obviously. Okay, I've gotten off topic here. I guess I'll just shut up now.
taraswizard	Re: overated (overhyped) BtVS episode	#11	[-]
Posts: 734 (01/08/04 21:29:24) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	OK, here we go again. Over at Hellmouth Central www.hellmouthcentral.com there are whole groups of posters going on about how great Fool for Love is, how it's one of the top five episodes of BtVS ever. These folks seem IMO, be extreme Spike fans and S/B shippers(no criticisms intended, just making observations) Their over adulation of this might be a little much, might be a little like mine own going on about Tough Love or Family. So as always, YMMV. MY opinion of FfL, it is a good episode, top five, no, top ten, maybe, top twenty, probably. Comments, please. Giving the pot here a nice stir. Allan Rosewarne Chicago area, IL W/T Forever Always W:...I think about what you grew up with and then I look at what you are, and it makes me proud. It makes me love you more T: Every time I--even when I am at my worst, you always make me feel special. --- How do you do that? W: Magic
taraswizard	Re: overated (overhyped) BtVS episode	#12	[-]
Posts: 734 (01/08/04 21:59:04) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Next post. I think Graduation Day might be the best season ending episode ever. Buffy saves Angel. The confrontation between Angel and the Mayor, and the Mayor is still dealing in the taunts and goads he's already used in Choices. The Mayor reads his horrid speech. Principal Snyder becomes a demon snack. Buffy blows up the demon and the high school along with it. Angel leaves Sunnydale. (Buffy acts out every teenager's ultimate fantasy, blowing your high school to fricking bits) I like The Gift lots, too. Stiring the pot some more. Allan Rosewarne Chicago area, IL W/T Forever Always W:...I think about what you grew up with and then I look at what you are, and it makes me proud. It makes me love you more T: Every time I--even when I am at my worst, you always make me feel special. --- How do you do that? W: Magic
taraswizard	Re: overated BtVS episode Band Candy	#13	[-]
Posts: 734 (03/17/04 19:10:04) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Band Candy. Probably my friend in Cincinatti's favorite episode. My reaction it's good, it's Ok, but anyones favorite!! Why?? OK, here's some analysis, lets bring out a very tired and much used SF trope, the candy (the water, whatever) makes the mature adults behave as immature juveniles. Oh, and combine with another old trope for the B story, the demon demands the town's infants as tribute. Nothing wrong with using the old tropes, but one can hope to dress them with some imagination and finesse. Sorry, do I think Band Candy is overated? By a huge factor. I do not think the episode is particularly funny, except for Snyder's dialogue, isn't that a peculiar Allan Rosewarne Chicago area, IL W/T Forever Always Ahira's Hangar http://pub189.ezboard.com/bahirashangar W:...I think about what you grew up with and then I look at what you are, and it makes me proud. It makes me love you more T: Every time I--even when I am at my worst, you always make me feel special. --- How do you do that? W: Magic

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